Thanks for assembling this list, Paul!
Tim
(click on the picture below to get a full size version)
Saturday, December 5, 2009
Comparing Conversion Costs with Paul
Paul Pancella (see link at right) put together a great spreadsheet comparing his Civic conversion costs with mine. There are a few minor updates, but things are very close for the most part. The only things that have changed on the Open Source Civic are the MES vacuum pump for the brakes and the fact that I ditched the custom tachometer and pillar pod. Even with these differences, the prices only change about $100.
Thanks for assembling this list, Paul!
Tim
(click on the picture below to get a full size version)
Thanks for assembling this list, Paul!
Tim
(click on the picture below to get a full size version)
Hints from Paul on Paktrakr Installation
I'm just cleaning up my e-mail this morning and found a message from Paul Pancella about more installation issues regarding the PakTrakr system:
I just wanted to pass this information along to all of you.
Cheers,
Tim
I can share my experience with the PakTrakr if you want. Ken Hall was very helpful, but the device itself was a little disappointing. The main thing is to be very careful with installation. The directions mention it, but it can't be emphasized enough, the remotes are easily destroyed if the ring terminals contact any battery terminals out of sequence. Depending on your physical setup, this can be hard to avoid during installation, since long wires are provided for each input. I'd recommend taping over all the ring terminals except the black one before getting near the car, then untaping individually as you install.
The temperature data from the remotes can be very useful, but the calibration on my units is at least 10 F degrees off. This was on my list of complaints when I twice sent the units back to Ken, but he was either unable or unwilling to do anything about it.
The individual module voltages are reported to 0.1 V precision, but again at least in my case, a few channels have offsets larger than this (up to 0.4 V). This magnitude is obviously significant in terms of balancing, so you will want to check every channel against a meter after installation. The offsets appear to be stable, so they can be accounted for if known.
I assume you will still have the Link-10? The PakTrakr has a "fuel gauge" function, but I'd guess the one on the Link-10 is a lot better. It will be interesting to compare them. I think mine is not very useful, maybe in part because it gets fooled by big voltage swings with regen. The whole system probably works better with lead acid than NiMH anyway.
I just wanted to pass this information along to all of you.
Cheers,
Tim
Tuesday, December 1, 2009
Installing the PakTrakr, Dead Aux Battery
Hi All,
The Civic-EV blog has been slow due to my bad batteries and being swamped at work. I got the recalibrated PakTrakr back a few weeks ago and finally had some time to install it tonight.
I've heard of some other folks blowing up their PakTrakr modules, so I tried a few tricks that seemed to work quite well in preventing spurious voltage spikes from killing the modules.
First of all, I needed to install two modules with six batteries apiece, so I split the battery pack into two halves. This does two things: it makes sure there is no current flowing in the cables and it isolates the two halves so that the PakTrakr modules don't see large voltage spikes when removing cables from the battery terminals.
Second, I put all the PakTrakr terminal loops in a plastic bag and only pulled one out at a time. This prevented the loops in the plastic bag from touching anything like the chassis or a battery terminal that could have provided a significantly higher/lower voltage.
Third, I installed each PakTrakr terminal loop from the lowest voltage up to the highest voltage and tightened the battery terminal at each step. This insured that each block of six batteries didn't get split up and introduce wide voltage variation.
The last trick involved connecting the two halves of the pack back together. Since I had to re-install a high current cable onto the battery lug, I removed the PakTrakr terminal first, touched the high-current cable to the battery lug (not to the Paktrakr terminal!) and then attached the PakTrakr terminal with a screw to the fully connected setup. Again, the intent of this was to prevent large voltage differences from blowing up the PakTrakr.
On a sadder note, I must have had a large leak in the system or a bad accessory battery, because it measured 2.9 volts after sitting in the car for a few weeks. This battery has probably been bad for awhile because one of the cells was bulged out, perhaps from the DC-DC converter dumping 40 amps into it. After some wrestling, I wiggled it out and will get a new one by the end of the week.
With the PakTrakr installed, I now have a good tool for seeing which batteries are dying first. Since I ran the car on a rather empty and unbalanced pack, I suspect I killed a battery or two. All batteries are at a nice 13.0-13.1 volts at full charge, but I suspect that some have significant loss in their capacity. We'll see...
The Civic-EV blog has been slow due to my bad batteries and being swamped at work. I got the recalibrated PakTrakr back a few weeks ago and finally had some time to install it tonight.
I've heard of some other folks blowing up their PakTrakr modules, so I tried a few tricks that seemed to work quite well in preventing spurious voltage spikes from killing the modules.
First of all, I needed to install two modules with six batteries apiece, so I split the battery pack into two halves. This does two things: it makes sure there is no current flowing in the cables and it isolates the two halves so that the PakTrakr modules don't see large voltage spikes when removing cables from the battery terminals.
Second, I put all the PakTrakr terminal loops in a plastic bag and only pulled one out at a time. This prevented the loops in the plastic bag from touching anything like the chassis or a battery terminal that could have provided a significantly higher/lower voltage.
Third, I installed each PakTrakr terminal loop from the lowest voltage up to the highest voltage and tightened the battery terminal at each step. This insured that each block of six batteries didn't get split up and introduce wide voltage variation.
The last trick involved connecting the two halves of the pack back together. Since I had to re-install a high current cable onto the battery lug, I removed the PakTrakr terminal first, touched the high-current cable to the battery lug (not to the Paktrakr terminal!) and then attached the PakTrakr terminal with a screw to the fully connected setup. Again, the intent of this was to prevent large voltage differences from blowing up the PakTrakr.
On a sadder note, I must have had a large leak in the system or a bad accessory battery, because it measured 2.9 volts after sitting in the car for a few weeks. This battery has probably been bad for awhile because one of the cells was bulged out, perhaps from the DC-DC converter dumping 40 amps into it. After some wrestling, I wiggled it out and will get a new one by the end of the week.
With the PakTrakr installed, I now have a good tool for seeing which batteries are dying first. Since I ran the car on a rather empty and unbalanced pack, I suspect I killed a battery or two. All batteries are at a nice 13.0-13.1 volts at full charge, but I suspect that some have significant loss in their capacity. We'll see...
Friday, October 30, 2009
John's PakTrakr Display
I shipped the PakTrakr modules back to the owner (Ken Hall) for calibration. Ken mentioned that they were rebuilding their calibration unit and would send the modules back as soon as it was finished.
I also received an e-mail from John Barton who used the open-source Civic battery rack design as a starting point for his own lithium-ion battery racks for his Civic DelSol:
Looking forward to getting my PakTrakr back...
I also received an e-mail from John Barton who used the open-source Civic battery rack design as a starting point for his own lithium-ion battery racks for his Civic DelSol:
Hi Tim,It looks like he has a cool display that takes the PakTrakr output and shows in a user friendly format. I'm quite swamped these days, so I'll consider trying it out if things slow down this winter.
I'm finishing up my second ev conversion, this time its a '93 Honda del Sol. My blog is http://mt-ev.blogspot.com. I'm also finishing a display for the paktrakr that runs on windows ce 5.0. I've got a basic version running on a GPS. Since you are using a paktrakr I thought you might like to give the display I wrote a try. Let me know if you are interested and I can send you an early version of the bits. I'll be blogging about it in a day or so.
The display I'm using is this:
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.22067
Also it requires a serial to bluetooth adapter like the IOGEAR.
Regards,
John Barton
Looking forward to getting my PakTrakr back...
Friday, October 16, 2009
Installing the PakTrakr
I took some time to install the PakTrakr modules today. I was a bit disappointed in the voltage measurements from the PakTrakr remotes, so I'll probably send them back for recalibration. Here are the voltages I measured:
Unit #2 isn't too far off, but batteries 4, 5 and 6 on unit #1 have too much error to accurately determine the state of the pack. I contacted Ken Hall at PakTrakr today for advice before I send the units back.
To help with air resistance, I might run to the plastics store and cover the entire front grille with a sheet of ABS plastic to see if that cuts down on the drag as well as the cooling effect on the front batteries...
| Unit #1 | |||
| Battery # | Battery(V) | PakTrakr(V) | Difference(mV) |
| 1 | 13.43 | 13.5 | 70 |
| 2 | 13.49 | 13.7 | 210 |
| 3 | 13.48 | 13.4 | -80 |
| 4 | 13.49 | 13.9 | 410 |
| 5 | 13.52 | 13.9 | 380 |
| 6 | 13.28 | 12.9 | -380 |
| Unit #2 | |||
| Battery # | Battery(V) | PakTrakr(V) | Difference(mV) |
| 1 | 13.41 | 13.5 | 90 |
| 2 | 13.46 | 13.7 | 240 |
| 3 | 13.47 | 13.4 | -70 |
| 4 | 13.46 | 13.7 | 240 |
| 5 | 13.5 | 13.7 | 200 |
| 6 | 13.29 | 13.5 | 210 |
Unit #2 isn't too far off, but batteries 4, 5 and 6 on unit #1 have too much error to accurately determine the state of the pack. I contacted Ken Hall at PakTrakr today for advice before I send the units back.
To help with air resistance, I might run to the plastics store and cover the entire front grille with a sheet of ABS plastic to see if that cuts down on the drag as well as the cooling effect on the front batteries...
Saturday, October 3, 2009
Range Anxiety
As you've probably noticed, things have been a bit quiet here. The new vacuum pump is working well and is nicely quiet.
As the temperatures drop, the capacity of my batteries drop as well. After almost a year of hard driving, I suspect the batteries are also losing capacity. Over the past week, I've been driving a gas car because I had long errands after work that would have exceeded the maximum range of the Civic-EV. The few times I did go into work, I ended up crawling along at five miles an hour for the last half-mile.
If I force myself to stay under 55 miles an hour at all times and use hypermiling techniques as much as possible, I don't lose power near the end of my commute, but as temperatures drop, I fear that I won't even be able to even get to work.
This is the classic problem with electric vehicles: range anxiety. I have plenty of power from the Warp9 motor, but the battery current and capacity just isn't enough for my commute anymore. I can't confidently drive on the freeways anymore because I might lose power after ten miles of pushing it past 60 mph. If I stop commuting with the electric vehicle, that takes away 90% of my driving, which makes owning the car somewhat pointless.
The first thing I'm going to do is install a PakTrakr monitor. This is something I should have done a year ago to accurately monitor each battery. The Link-10 E-meter is good, but doesn't monitor individual batteries. For all I know, I might just have one bad battery in the pack. I already have the PakTrakr on my bench, but I haven't had time to install it. I just might do that this weekend.
Some options to consider:
As the temperatures drop, the capacity of my batteries drop as well. After almost a year of hard driving, I suspect the batteries are also losing capacity. Over the past week, I've been driving a gas car because I had long errands after work that would have exceeded the maximum range of the Civic-EV. The few times I did go into work, I ended up crawling along at five miles an hour for the last half-mile.
If I force myself to stay under 55 miles an hour at all times and use hypermiling techniques as much as possible, I don't lose power near the end of my commute, but as temperatures drop, I fear that I won't even be able to even get to work.
This is the classic problem with electric vehicles: range anxiety. I have plenty of power from the Warp9 motor, but the battery current and capacity just isn't enough for my commute anymore. I can't confidently drive on the freeways anymore because I might lose power after ten miles of pushing it past 60 mph. If I stop commuting with the electric vehicle, that takes away 90% of my driving, which makes owning the car somewhat pointless.
The first thing I'm going to do is install a PakTrakr monitor. This is something I should have done a year ago to accurately monitor each battery. The Link-10 E-meter is good, but doesn't monitor individual batteries. For all I know, I might just have one bad battery in the pack. I already have the PakTrakr on my bench, but I haven't had time to install it. I just might do that this weekend.
Some options to consider:
- Purchase a whole new set of batteries for $3000 (ick!).
- Spend a lot of time making the car aerodynamic like the Aero-Civic
- Redo the system with lithium-ion batteries and double the amp-hours for $10,000 and lots of time (ouch!).
- Sell the vehicle at cost minus the price for the batteries, go with an ICE and buy a Nissan Leaf when it comes out.
Saturday, September 5, 2009
New Vacuum Pump and Fixed Wiper System
Sorry folks, no pictures today. I'm taking this long weekend to just relax and get some things done around the house while avoiding the crazy Labor Day weekend traffic.
One thing that's really been annoying me about the Civic is that the intermittent wiper setting doesn't work. After taking awhile to pry out the ICU (Integrated Control Unit) mounted on the back of the fuse box, I opened it up and tried some tests with a 12V battery to verify failure. After going to LKQ self-service auto-parts, I lucked out and found a Civic with another ICU in it as well as a grey trim piece I was missing. After shelling out a whopping $6.50 for these salvaged parts, I came home, snapped in the spare ICU and the wiper system started working again. Yay! I'm all ready for the long rainy winter here in Portland.
On a more relevant note to you EV folks, I also spent most of the day replacing my old Gast Vacuum pump and vacuum chamber with an MES 70/6E Swiss-made vacuum pump from MetricMind. I was lucky enough that it fit in the same space as the Gast pump and the vacuum tube from the pump to the brake assist chamber is only about 16" long. The MES pump is MUCH quieter than the Gast system, has a built in one-way valve and much less hysteresis than the Gast system. While it cost more ($315 instead of $285), the price difference wasn't that much.
I just finished my first test drive about 30 minutes ago and I really like this new vacuum pump. It's far quieter than the Gast system and has much more even braking pressure due to the smaller hysteresis. While the MES pump does come on much more often, it's so quiet I can only hear it when the car is completely stopped at a light without much noise going on around me. My initial thoughts are very positive and I recommend this for new people converting EVs.
Now that the intermittent wiper system is fixed and brake vacuum pump is upgraded, I don't plan on doing any more work on the Civic for awhile. I think the next major project (If I don't go out and purchase a Nissan "Leaf" outright) is to upgrade the batteries to lithium-ion types when the AGM lead-acid batteries die. Hopefully that will be two years out.
With the downturn in the economy and factory-made EVs being announced for next year, I've noticed far less EV projects happening these days. If people are doing conversions, they're doing them to older, more "classic" cars. These next few years are going to be quite interesting.
Drop me a comment if you're still working on a Civic EV. It's good to hear what projects are going on.
Cheers,
Tim
One thing that's really been annoying me about the Civic is that the intermittent wiper setting doesn't work. After taking awhile to pry out the ICU (Integrated Control Unit) mounted on the back of the fuse box, I opened it up and tried some tests with a 12V battery to verify failure. After going to LKQ self-service auto-parts, I lucked out and found a Civic with another ICU in it as well as a grey trim piece I was missing. After shelling out a whopping $6.50 for these salvaged parts, I came home, snapped in the spare ICU and the wiper system started working again. Yay! I'm all ready for the long rainy winter here in Portland.
On a more relevant note to you EV folks, I also spent most of the day replacing my old Gast Vacuum pump and vacuum chamber with an MES 70/6E Swiss-made vacuum pump from MetricMind. I was lucky enough that it fit in the same space as the Gast pump and the vacuum tube from the pump to the brake assist chamber is only about 16" long. The MES pump is MUCH quieter than the Gast system, has a built in one-way valve and much less hysteresis than the Gast system. While it cost more ($315 instead of $285), the price difference wasn't that much.
I just finished my first test drive about 30 minutes ago and I really like this new vacuum pump. It's far quieter than the Gast system and has much more even braking pressure due to the smaller hysteresis. While the MES pump does come on much more often, it's so quiet I can only hear it when the car is completely stopped at a light without much noise going on around me. My initial thoughts are very positive and I recommend this for new people converting EVs.
Now that the intermittent wiper system is fixed and brake vacuum pump is upgraded, I don't plan on doing any more work on the Civic for awhile. I think the next major project (If I don't go out and purchase a Nissan "Leaf" outright) is to upgrade the batteries to lithium-ion types when the AGM lead-acid batteries die. Hopefully that will be two years out.
With the downturn in the economy and factory-made EVs being announced for next year, I've noticed far less EV projects happening these days. If people are doing conversions, they're doing them to older, more "classic" cars. These next few years are going to be quite interesting.
Drop me a comment if you're still working on a Civic EV. It's good to hear what projects are going on.
Cheers,
Tim
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